Tomato Watch
I just set out my tomato plants today, May 14, because the weatherman assured me nighttime temperatures will be above 40 and the plants were getting leggy and wanting to take over my house. I am keeping a row cover handy, however, because I know not to trust Idaho weather, or the weather forecast. But I'm curious about other gardener's tomato patches at various elevations and latitudes. When do you traditionally set out plants, start them indoors, stake and harvest? Varieties? If I say I planted a hybrid will somebody snap at me? Determinate? Indeterminate? Varieties best for sauce, snacking, canning, salsa? How about those green striped doozies?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Kristin W. on -
Hi Penelope,
I just planted my tomato plants today as well, along with pretty much everything else that's going in this year (except my baby watermelons, which aren't big enough to transplant yet). Here in Maine, it's also pretty brave to put them out this early, but the temps have been pretty warm, and we're expecting cloudy, showery weather for the next few days, so we shouldn't have any frost. Still risky.
I'm not very exciting in my choices of varieties. I plant beafsteaks and cherry tomatoes only. My kids eat cherry tomatoes by the mixing bowl full when they're ripe, so I have to plant those. I start them inside - they'd never grow in time to be ready by frost if planted outside. I stake them (cages, actually) when I plant them, or I won't do it (like last year) and will end up with lots of tomatoes on the ground. Best for me to do it while I'm in full garden frenzy mode, rather than trying to get back to it when I'm in full sitting-by-the-pool mode. Harvest is sometimes late July, August, and until frost in September. Last year I was bringing in green tomatoes to ripen inside because the plants were still producing at frost time.
I have to say, I am thrilled that the seedlings are out in the garden, and no longer gracing (most of) my kitchen table! :)
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Permalink Reply by Ian on -
Hi Penelope,
At a latitude much the same as you but a mediteranean climate which is perhaps a little warmer,
I'm growing three varieties, Marmande which is a local beef tomato - very flavoursome and a favourite French variety, Cerise rouge, which is simply red cherry, and a variety called Golden Sunrise which my father in law grew and always tasted really nice and sweet. They are a yellow cherry tomato.
I sowed the first seeds indoors in late February and my plants have all been out for about 2 weeks now.
Golden Sunrise are delicious to pick and eat like little sweets.
Ian
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Permalink Reply by Terri on -
I won't be able to plant my tomatoes out for at least another 2 weeks, the soil is just too cold. We are expecting frost tonight! For varieties I plant some heirloom and some hybrids- Big Beef, Brandywine, Striped Cavern (new to me this year), Lemon Boy, Roma, and an orangy cherry type I can't remember the name of. I think that's it for this year. I tried to get a white currant type to try this year but couldn't get the seeds, perhaps next year. I start them indoors (window sill) through March (and April if I'm late) and they are in a small unheated greenhouse after they get potted up around the end of April. Last year I had blooms shortly after setting out in June. This year I am leaving 2 beefstakes in the greenhouse planted in the ground to see how they fare.
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Permalink Reply by Maya on -
Started three varieties -- all indeterminate -- in February and have transplanted twice, each time burying stems to first leaves. We now have beautiful, stocky plants which were weaned off bottom heat a couple of weeks ago and have been hardening off. Tomorrow they go in the ground in a raised bed with row cover, along with peppers and artichokes (the other two came back!). Night time temperatures have been in the mid-40s (around 4°C?) so we're definitely warming up. Our last frost date is generally the end of May. Memorial Day weekend is when everyone has their planting frenzy here, though that's very early this year. We are three blocks from the ocean, so that moderates temperatures even within our hardiness zone. You must have the opposite effect because of your elevation.
So what we have are: Moskvich for sauce and drying, Matt's Wild Cherry (from Johnny's Selected Seeds, they are supposed to be how tomatoes grow in the wild in Mexico, they are tiny and very sweet) for in situ snacking, and Striped German for salads. We got Green Zebra tomatoes from our CSA last year and they didn't go over very well; all agreed that eating green tomatoes just wasn't right. Striped Germans are a bright red and yellow. If they're not too watery, I think they'd make pretty jars of sun-dried tomatoes for the pantry shelves.
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Permalink Reply by Penelope on -
Last year i planted a 'black' tomato. It was ok, a bit "watery" but not delicious enough for me to grow it again. I am hoping I can find a Brandywine at the Farmer's Market this weekend. The sauce tomato I started indoors myself from seed (the name won't materialize in my estrogen deprived brain) is actually "square". I was skeptical when I bought the seeds, an attempt to make packing and shipping easy above flavor?? but it was very prolific and tastey.
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Permalink Reply by Brook on -
>Generally in Kentucky everyone marks the safe planting date by the Kentucky Derby/first Saturday in May.<
I don't know where in Kentucky you live, Steph. But considering that except for far western Kentucky the average last frost date is May 10, I don't know anybody---let alone everyone---who uses the Derby as a safe-planting date.
Many people take a chance. And most years get away with it. But then comes years like last spring......
Technically, one should wait at least 2 weeks after last frost for the soil to warm up before planting tender crops. Ideally the soil temp will be 60F or better, and overnight temps not drop below 60.
True, few people wait for ideal conditions. But the fact remains, planting the first of May is iffy at best.
I haven't planted yet because it's been too wet to get back there. Seems like it hasn't stopped pouring since January. Looks like I'm going to go with container planting this year.
I've cut way back on tomatoes. This season I'm only planting Brandt's Old German Pink; Super Choice; and Old Kentucky among the standards. DePinto will be my paste tomato. Personally I don't care for cherry tomatoes---if I want a candy bar I'll eat a Snickers. But Friend Wife has a passion for them. For her I'm growing Matts Wild Cherry and Grape.
Obviously all heirlooms. I won't put a hybrid anything in the ground---as much for political reasons as horticultural ones. But, frankly, I don't understand how anyone who professes to believe in sustainability can plant a hybrid.
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Permalink Reply by Penelope on
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Brook, I remember seeing a catalog just for tomato seed that had them distinctly classified by heirloom -- and hybrid -- do you know the name of the company? Or where do you get your seeds/plants?
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Permalink Reply by Maya on
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Penelope, any reputable seed catalogue will have heirlooms separated from hybrids, or at least labeled. Territorial Seed (www.territorialseed.com), Johnny's Selected Seeds (www.johnnyseeds.com), Cook's Garden (www.cooksgarden.com), and John Scheeper's (www.kitchengardenseeds.com) all have many varieties of both.
At Territorial, I've rediscovered a variety of pepper I used to play with in my younger days in Spain. They are from a small town in the northwest called Padrón, so they're called pimientos de Padrón. Most of them are sweet, but in every batch there are several really hot ones (hotter than jalapeños and serranos, not as hot as habañeros) and there's no way to tell them apart (although, of course, there are many theories - ha!). So the peppers are fried whole in olive oil and sprinkled with coarse salt. Then everyone stands around and dares each other. My middle school students want to play, so we've planted some at school and some at home. I hope it works out well and that it's not a peculiarity of Padrón-area soils that makes them what they are.
So seeds have gotten so expensive, this year I solemnly swear I'm going to save the seed of anything that works well for us.
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Permalink Reply by Penelope on
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I know most seed catalogs have them separated. I was just trying to remember this specific catalog. I guess I didn't word things very well---symptom of spring???
And I'm guilty of planting hybrids and I cook with oil from GM plants and who knows what other sustainable sins I commit . . .sigh.
That pepper sounds intriguing. I like the zing of hot in stirfries and curries, but not the kind that brings on a fever.
Along the same vein. I wonder if Walla Walla sweets are more about the Eastern Washington and Palouse area volcanic soils than the variety, because they've never turned out as sweet for me. But then higher altitudes/cooler nights, I've heard, also influence sweetness in onions and fruits as well.
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Permalink Reply by Brook on
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Being as I don't plant hybrids I can't help you with that, Penelope. But, as Maya notes, even mainstream seed companies at least label their heirlooms (or what they claim are heirlooms---they're often wrong).
There are two you might be thinking of: Totally Tomatoes and Tomato Growers Supply. The latter is reputable. The former is not someone you want to do business with.
The best selection of tomato seed comes from Marianne Jones, at MariSeed.com. No hybrids in her collection, however. And I still don't understand why you would want them.
As for heirloom seed, there are at least two dozen companies that specialize in heirlooms and open pollinated plants. Among them: Southern Exposure Seed Exchange; Victory Seeds; Baker Creek Heirloom Seeds; Territorial Seed; and the SSE Public Catalog. .
Several non-profit seed preservation groups also offer seed for sale. Check out Abundant Life, Native Seed /SEARCH, Sustainable Mountain Agricultre Center, and Seed Savers Exchange.
As for me, I can't remember the last time I bought seed. I'm a major player in the heirlooms community, and either directly collect family heirlooms or trade with other collectors. Or, as often happens, I'm merely gifted with them.
One of the beauties of open pollinated plants, of course, is that acquisition is a one-time thing. After that you simply save seed.
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Permalink Reply by Penelope on
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It isn't that I WANT hybrids; it's just that I don't always start my own seed and when I get to the local greenhouse, that's what they're selling. I did start the paste tomatoes this year. I've noticed the differences in shapes of tomato leaves and shades of green too, like grapes.
Thanks for the names, but what's the "business" problem?
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Permalink Reply by Brook on
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An incredible number of complaints, found all over the net, ranging from slow deliveries, to bad seed, to mislabled seed, to refusal to make good on bad orders.
Given the number of good seed houses (there are, in North America, 254 seed companies that sell open-pollinated seed), why take a chance on somebody nobody trusts?
I haven't spoken to Marianne Jones in awhile, but she was talking, awhile back, about shipping bare-root plants. You might check with her on that.
Roger Postley, in Lexington, Kentucky, will ship plants. But he's quickly running low on stock. You might contact him at rpostley@aol.com and see what he has available.
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